ISO 9000-3 Digest Monday, 16 December 1996 Volume 01 : Number 027
In this issue:
re: HOAXES
SSQ December Meeting
how do I unsubscribe
Re: how do I unsubscribe
ISO 9000-3
[none]
QUESTION: Company self-registration
Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
BOUNCE iso9000-3@quality.org: Non-member submission from [John Deprez ] (fwd)
Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Bill Casti, CQA (Moderator)"
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 16:51:36 -0500 (EST)
Subject: re: HOAXES
NOTE: This message is being posted to all lists at QUALITY.ORG. If you
belong to more than one list here, you will receive duplicate postings.
My apologies for that, but there is no simple way to prevent it.
- -----------------------
All,
I have just received a request for approval for a message containing
information about the so-called "Deeyenda" virus.
The "Deeyenda" virus is a hoax. It does not exist. There is no such
thing as virus which can execute simply by being passed in e.mail. If you
want more info about this and other hoaxes, point your browser at
http://www.kumite.com/myths/
There was also an Information Bulletin sent out by the CIAC last week that
is "Recommended Reading".
Title: Internet Hoaxes: PKZ300, Irina, Good Times, Deeyenda, Ghost
URL: http://ciac.llnl.gov/ciac/bulletins/h-05.shtml
Please be VERY CAREFUL when you send messages such as this, or other
security threats. Check your sources and make sure what you post is
correct.
If you RECEIVE any messages purporting to warn you of "email viruses", be
sure to also point those ill-informed individuals to sites such as those
above, so they can get educated, too!
Regards.
Bill
==============================================================================
Bill Casti, CQA Email: help@quality.org
Domain Owner Pager: +1 800 604 6149
QUALITY.ORG Fax: +1 703 834 8209
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
QUALITY RESOURCES ONLINE at: http://www.quality.org/qc
==============================================================================
------------------------------
From: "Paquin, Sherolyn A."
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 15:45:47 -0500
Subject: SSQ December Meeting
Society for Software Quality, Inc.
Washington Area Chapter
Presents Guest Speaker: John Moore
Topic: The Software Project Control Panel
Date: Tuesday, December 10, 1996
Time: 7:00 PM Refreshments/Networking; 7:30 PM Meeting
Place: Hughes STX, Greenbelt, Maryland (Directions below)
Who: All are invited. SSQ Membership not required for attendance.
General Sponsors: Hughes STX, BDM, SPC, Loral, PRC, AMS
About the Topic
The Software Project Control Panel is a tool for visualizing and
monitoring
the condition of a project. The displays on the panel, if updated
regularly
and kept within acceptable ranges, will help a project stay on course.
The
panel includes gauges and charts on a range of important project metrics,
such as cumulative earned value, elapsed time, total cost, CPI, TCPI,
total
program performance efficiency, tasks, quality gates progress, aggregate
schedule growth, aggregate requirements growth, voluntary turnover,
overtime
hours, risk impact, risk liability, warning indicators, and defects by
activities. The gauges include redlines and warning indicators to
highlight
danger zones.
Dr. Moore will describe the background of the control panel from its
inception at the Airlie Software Council to its currently implementation
as
an MS Excel VBA application. He will demonstrate the control panel which
is
currently undergoing beta testing. He will answer questions about the
control panel and have available software project management literature
from
the Software Program Manager's Network for distribution. This talk will
be
of interest to anyone who is investigating project performance metrics or
ways to improve communication of project level information to the entire
project team.
About the Speaker
Dr. Moore is an employee of Computers and Concepts Associates which
operates
the Software Program Manager's Network. He has over 17 years experience
as a
software developer, project manager, and engineer. He has contributed
papers
and articles on software project management, software maintenance, risk
assessment, energy systems, and infrastructure management systems. He
has
just completed a pocket guidebook on earned value project management for
software projects and is leading an initiative to improve estimating for
real
time systems.
The Software Program Managers Network (SPMN) was formed in 1992 by the
Assistant Secretary of the Navy for all services and OSD agencies. The
Network's goal is to identify highly effective practices from industry,
government, and academia and convey them to software managers and
practitioners to improve the cost, schedule and performance of weapons,
command and control, and information systems. These best practices and
lessons learned are disseminated through Direct Satellite Broadcasts, the
NETFOCUS newsletter, workshops, symposia, guidebooks, videotapes, and
other
media.
Future Meetings:
Date, Speaker, Topic, Location
Jan 14, Mark Servello, Why to NOT have a SPA, Virginia
Jan 27, Roundtable, Internet Security, Maryland
Directions
Take the Beltway to the BW Pkwy North exit. Once on the BW Pkwy, take
the
Greenbelt NASA exit. Turn toward the Greenway Plaza Shopping Center and
then
a right at the next light (just after the shopping center). Hughes STX
is on
the left hand side. Enter the parking lot at the second left entrance.
The
meeting will be in room 438.
For More Information:
Call Chris Dryer (202) 767-2894 (e-mail: dryer@mustang.nrl.navy.mil)
or Steve Leydorf (410) 573-7286 for further information.
Open to All:To receive monthly e-mail updates contact Chris
Dryer: dryer@mustang.nrl.navy.mil
------------------------------
From: Vivian Hindbo
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 14:53:08 -0700
Subject: how do I unsubscribe
Sorry for the noise on the list--I've lost the
address of the list administrator.
- --
Vivian Hindbo
Document Design Analyst
mailto:vivian.hindbo@actc.ab.ca
ACTC Technologies Inc.
http://www.actc.ab.ca
------------------------------
From: Dave Grummer
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 11:04:14 +0900 (JST)
Subject: Re: how do I unsubscribe
unsubscribe iso9000-3 Chris Lamatsch
Dave Grummer
Fusion Systems Japan,Inc.
No.2 Toshin Aobadai Bldg,9th Fl,
Aobadai,3-17-18 Meguro-ku,
Tokyo 153,Japan.
Tel : 81-3-5456-7561
Fax : 81-3-5458-4422
grummerd@fsj.co.jp
http://www.fsj.co.jp
On Thu, 5 Dec 1996, Vivian Hindbo wrote:
> From: Vivian Hindbo
> Sorry for the noise on the list--I've lost the
> address of the list administrator.
> --
> Vivian Hindbo
> Document Design Analyst
> mailto:vivian.hindbo@actc.ab.ca
> ACTC Technologies Inc.
> http://www.actc.ab.ca
>
------------------------------
From: Kathy Reynolds
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 11:43:06 -0800
Subject: ISO 9000-3
Hello:
I am trying to obtain the latest version of ISO 9000-3. It has been
updated since the 1991 version.
Could you please tell me how I can obtain the latest version and how much
it costs?
I am also interested in the latest version of the TickIT Guide.
Thank you,
Kathy Reynolds
KReynolds@cc.atinc.com
------------------------------
From: accioly@copa.rio.com.br (felipe accioly)
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 08:13:29 -0300
Subject: [none]
unsubscribe iso9000-3
------------------------------
From: gdaczkow@telesciences.com (Greta H Daczkowski)
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 96 15:38 EST
Subject: QUESTION: Company self-registration
Well, it has been a long time since I have heard of any activity on
this mail list. So, here is a question!
I've heard that some larger companies (Bellcore, Hewlett Packard) are able
to register themselves to ISO-9001/2/3. Is this possible?
I would expect that they would have to have a separate business unit
independent of the rest of the company so there isn't any bias?
Would they also have to certify their auditors through RAB?
Please respond quickly, I need an answer by Monday.
Thanks
Greta Daczkowski
===================================================================
_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ Greta Daczkowski
_/ _/ _/ System Test Engineer
_/ _/_/_/ _/ _/ Securicor Telesciences
_/ _/ _/ _/ (609) 866-1000
_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ email:g.daczkowski@telesciences.com
snailmail:351 New Albany Rd
Moorestown, NJ 08057
==================================================================
------------------------------
From: Glen Ford
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:44:21 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
At 15:38 1996-12-13 EST, you wrote:
>From: gdaczkow@telesciences.com (Greta H Daczkowski)
>Well, it has been a long time since I have heard of any activity on
>this mail list. So, here is a question!
>
>I've heard that some larger companies (Bellcore, Hewlett Packard) are able
>to register themselves to ISO-9001/2/3. Is this possible?
Sure, why not? They need quality systems as much as (or more than) anyone else.
>
>I would expect that they would have to have a separate business unit
>independent of the rest of the company so there isn't any bias?
I presume that you mean for auditors? If so the only thing they require is
that the auditor not be part of the area being audited. So someone from say
accounting could audit the shipping area, someone from shipping could audit
manufacturing and so on.
However, from a purely practical point of view, most larger organizations
have one or more audit groups already in existance. The internal audit group
reports directly to the audit commitee (they deal primarily with the
financial audits). There is usually a pre-existing Quality Assurance group
which can also be used. Either of these groups are usually added to (IA) or
converted over to (QA) in order to provide internal auditors.
Having said that, some organizations choose specifically to avoid using
those groups. Instead they pull people out of other areas as required. To a
certain extent the choice reflects the culture of the organization, and the
difficulty of selling ISO to the company (involvement=commitment).
>
>Would they also have to certify their auditors through RAB?
>
That depends on where they are. In the US I believe that it would be wise as
an absolute minimum (in other words IMVHAUO yes).
>Please respond quickly, I need an answer by Monday.
>
>Thanks
>
>Greta Daczkowski
Glen D. Ford
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
Bwca Management Consulting/CanDa Software
visit our Websites at: www.io.org/~gford/bwca.html
and www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
Pick up free software at www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
Read our Organizational Development Models at www.io.org/~gford/bwca/models.html
Comments are encouraged.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
"Hey, ya gotta laugh ...."
__________________________________________________________________
------------------------------
From: John Deprez
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 08:52:49 +0100
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
Glen Ford wrote:
>
> From: Glen Ford
> At 15:38 1996-12-13 EST, you wrote:
> >From: gdaczkow@telesciences.com (Greta H Daczkowski)
> >Well, it has been a long time since I have heard of any activity on
> >this mail list. So, here is a question!
> >
> >I've heard that some larger companies (Bellcore, Hewlett Packard) are able
> >to register themselves to ISO-9001/2/3. Is this possible?
>
> Sure, why not? They need quality systems as much as (or more than) anyone else.
>
>
Maybe there is a misunderstanding here, but if you say REGISTER, I
understand
it as obtaining a certificate, right ?
Then the company that issues the certificate (thus does the assesment)
must be registred, so if they have a registration body, I think it could
be possible,
as long as they are indeed independant.
------------------------------
From: "Bill Casti, CQA (Moderator)"
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 10:11:56 -0500 (EST)
Subject: BOUNCE iso9000-3@quality.org: Non-member submission from [John Deprez ] (fwd)
NOTE: Respond *both* to the poster's address (see below) and to the list's
posting address, OR as directed in the posting, but definitely NOT to me.
Thanks.
Bill
- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 02:55:15 -0500
From: John Deprez
Organization: Alcatel Bell Telephone Belgium
To: iso9000-3@quality.org
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
Glen Ford wrote:
>
> From: Glen Ford
> At 15:38 1996-12-13 EST, you wrote:
> >From: gdaczkow@telesciences.com (Greta H Daczkowski)
> >Well, it has been a long time since I have heard of any activity on
> >this mail list. So, here is a question!
> >
> >I've heard that some larger companies (Bellcore, Hewlett Packard) are able
> >to register themselves to ISO-9001/2/3. Is this possible?
>
> Sure, why not? They need quality systems as much as (or more than) anyone else.
>
>
Maybe there is a misunderstanding here, but if you say REGISTER, I
understand
it as obtaining a certificate, right ?
Then the company that issues the certificate (thus does the assesment)
must be registred, so if they have a registration body, I think it could
be possible,
as long as they are indeed independant.
------------------------------
From: Glen Ford
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 18:52:10 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Company self-registration
Oops ... that'll teach me to read the subject line.
I guess I didn't answer the question you asked so I'll try again.
First off, you might want to read the archives for the ISO9000 list. There
have been a number of discussions lately regarding self-registration. In the
mean time I'll try to summarize the discussion:
1. ISO Registration is a customer driven requirement. If your customers
require ISO registration then it makes sense to get registered. If they do
not then it doesn't make sense to register.
2. Meeting the ISO900x requirements does provide a number of benefits in and
of itself, exclusive of the benefits of registration.
3. Third party registrars are used to provide independant proof that your
system meets the ISO900x requirements. The alternatives to external
registrars are second party audits (ie the customer checks for himself) and
acceptance of supplier claims. Therefore if you do not use a third party
registrar then it forces your client to accept your claims sight unseen or
else to check themselves.
4. If a customer is using your ISO900x registration to justify some of their
own actions (or more likely inactions) then their registrar may not accept
self-registration (should not in fact). This may mean that your customers
may need to consider you as an un-registered supplier and add appropriate
steps (audits or inspections). This would increase their costs for using
your product versus another supplier.
5. Why should the customer believe your claims of ISO900x if you can't be
bothered to verify it through a third party.
6. The general opinion seems to be that self-registration is a serious blow
to the creditability of ISO900x designations.
As for your question regarding RAB certified auditors. It's irrelevant.
Anyone who requires RAB certified auditors won't accept self-registration.
And anyone who accepts self-registration probably won't check if there was
an audit let alone RAB certified auditors. Finally anyone who'll go to the
trouble of auditing you before buying from you probably won't use the
internal auditors for more than cursory checking anyway.
At 23:44 1996-12-13 -0500, you wrote:
>From: Glen Ford
>At 15:38 1996-12-13 EST, you wrote:
>>From: gdaczkow@telesciences.com (Greta H Daczkowski)
>>Well, it has been a long time since I have heard of any activity on
>>this mail list. So, here is a question!
>>
>>I've heard that some larger companies (Bellcore, Hewlett Packard) are able
>>to register themselves to ISO-9001/2/3. Is this possible?
>
>Sure, why not? They need quality systems as much as (or more than) anyone else.
>
>>
>>I would expect that they would have to have a separate business unit
>>independent of the rest of the company so there isn't any bias?
>
>I presume that you mean for auditors? If so the only thing they require is
>that the auditor not be part of the area being audited. So someone from say
>accounting could audit the shipping area, someone from shipping could audit
>manufacturing and so on.
>
>However, from a purely practical point of view, most larger organizations
>have one or more audit groups already in existance. The internal audit group
>reports directly to the audit commitee (they deal primarily with the
>financial audits). There is usually a pre-existing Quality Assurance group
>which can also be used. Either of these groups are usually added to (IA) or
>converted over to (QA) in order to provide internal auditors.
>
>Having said that, some organizations choose specifically to avoid using
>those groups. Instead they pull people out of other areas as required. To a
>certain extent the choice reflects the culture of the organization, and the
>difficulty of selling ISO to the company (involvement=commitment).
>
>
>>
>>Would they also have to certify their auditors through RAB?
>>
>
>That depends on where they are. In the US I believe that it would be wise as
>an absolute minimum (in other words IMVHAUO yes).
>
>
>>Please respond quickly, I need an answer by Monday.
>>
>>Thanks
>>
>>Greta Daczkowski
>
>
>Glen D. Ford
>Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
>Bwca Management Consulting/CanDa Software
>visit our Websites at: www.io.org/~gford/bwca.html
> and www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
>Pick up free software at www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
>Read our Organizational Development Models at
www.io.org/~gford/bwca/models.html
>Comments are encouraged.
>------------------------------------------------------------------
>"Hey, ya gotta laugh ...."
>__________________________________________________________________
>
>
Glen D. Ford
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
Bwca Management Consulting/CanDa Software
visit our Websites at: www.io.org/~gford/bwca.html
and www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
Pick up free software at www.io.org/~gford/canda.html
Read our Organizational Development Models at www.io.org/~gford/bwca/models.html
Comments are encouraged.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
"Hey, ya gotta laugh ...."
__________________________________________________________________
------------------------------
End of ISO 9000-3 Digest V1 #27
*******************************